Standing in a sand pit in a playground off Santa Monica Boulevard in Los Angeles, Robert Gant could easily pass for the muscular guy who kicks sand in skinny kids' faces--could, that is, ecept for that radiant smile he flashes. It's the grin of the onetime weakling who has transformed himself into the strong, confident homecoming king; the simle that says, If I can get here from there, you can too.
Gant, 33, whose friends call him Bobby, is at once a teacher and a learner. He has that in common with Ben Bruckner, the HIV-positive literature professor he has played this season on Showtime's hit series Queer as Folk. The show's writers envisioned Ben to be "just as comfortable in front of the classroom as he is on the dance floor," Gant recalls, and the actor seems just as comfortable in a playground posing for beefy photographs as he was a few days earlier talking about his personal and spiritual growth for this interview.
But finding comfort in his own skin has been a long journey for Gant. Coming out publicly in this magazine is just the latest step in his lifelong effort to meld sometimes wildly different impulses. He once hated his body and ate his way to being overweight; now he shows up for an interview in an enclosed West Hollywood patio--half a block from his apartment--with an impromptu dinner of cottage cheese and pineapple. He once attended Georgetown University Law Center on his way to a position with the world's biggest law firm. Now he has 10 years as a working actor under his belt, including 40-plus commercials and roles on series such as Friends and Popular.
But it's Ben Bruckner who has transformed Gant's life. Not only is Queer as Folk a steady gig ("Ben will be back every episode next season," he promises), it quickly brought him to the realization he needed to go public as a gay man. It was one thing to entertain the children as the Good Humor Man in one of his 40 or 50 television commercials and not be openly gay--"I remember thinking how ironic it was that I was this gay guy playing this American icon," he says. But it was quite another to find himself on gaydom's most-talked-about series and have to dodge the question when Larry King asked if he was gay. "It was painful for me, in retrospect, to have to sit with that," Gant says.
Now he's ready to follow in Ben's footsteps in one more way: He's going on the record. "I read your interview in The Advocate!" exclaimed Ted (Scott Lowell) when pal Michael (Hal Sparks) introduced boyfriend Ben in Gant's first QAF episode. "You're so honest and so forthright and so revealing!"
And he is.
When you joined Queer as Folk, you didn't lie about being gay--you just said, "I don't want to talk about it now. There will come a time." Tell me how you came to that time.
I was immediately excited and afraid at the same time. I was thrilled by this character; I was thrilled by what the show was doing--certainly what it represented to me on a personal level. Amazing, actually, to get to say that--that I'm sitting here telling you. I have not been able to say that one of the things that so excited me at the outset was, Oh, my God, this show is about my life! I related to Ben with respect to our spiritual journey and, I think, self-realization process.
A change of pace for you.
Yeah. My career [before this] has been all about playing the romantic interest of some woman, wheter on Caroline in the City or Friends or [Showtime's] Rude Awakening. Just one after the next after the next. Commercials? I'm always that romantic lead guy. And I didn't feel like I had examples out there of people who had made the choice to be openly gay who were in my category--who were leading men in the way that Ben Affleck is a leading man. There are many courageous actors who I very much choice and who've been fine. [But] their careers weren't based on playing that romantic lead.
But no one was pressuring you to come out publicly.
No, it's not something I had to do. I'm just telling the truth. Gandhi said, 'Be the change you wish to see in the world," and so I guess I'm being the change that I wish to see. I think that I would hate to be the last one to finally wake up and realize, Why aren't you just being honest?
I don't think there's any danger of your being the last one in Hollywood to come out.
[Laughs] No, and that's what contributed to my fear. I think it's really screwed up that we have to go through this in the first place.
But why is this important to you personally?
Because I'm not living the life that I want to live. Because I didn't like being on the set of Caroline and having one of the actresses hinting and saying "So what are you doing for Valentine's Day?" and ont being able to say, "You know, I really appreciate the interest, [but] I'm gay." It's a quality-of-life thing. I Definitely have a lot to gain. Arguably, I have more to gain than anyone. I have myself to gain. And I really believe that everything happens exactly when and how it's supposed to. A friend of mine says, "In God's world there are no mistakes, only lessons." So I'm coming out exactly when I'm supposed to.
I don't know what comes next. I've spent most of my life focused on the past or the future, and a lot of my growth right now is about focusing on the present--like Ben says, "It's about the now." And it's dangerous for me to get into that whole...the grandiosity of it all, you know? It's dangerous to start to put myself on a pedestal.
But other people will do that for you. When you come back home to West Hollywood this spring after having been in Toronto for so long, was it different for you to suddenly be Ben from Queer as Folk?
Yeah, it's different--which excites that old part of me that still yearns for that. I was in the frame shop the other day trying to pick out a frame, and it was really, really difficult because every single person that came in--this was in West Hollywood--went through the "Oh, my God!" [greeting when they first saw me]. And then in turned into, "Oh, I really don't like that frame." And they would sit there for 20 minutes telling me what I should get for this picture. And I was very grateful--I tried to be gracious--but at the same time, I realized that there's a boundary issue that starts to take place.
An interesting combination of familiarity and fantasy.
It really came up for me [at Florida's Walt Disney WOrld] in Orlando. [For Gay Days,] people from all over come in from all over. So you get a lot of folks who are even more excited--far more excited than people in L.A. would be--to see someone from TV. And not just TV but "the gay television show." There was one guy from Caracas [Venezuela], another from Mexico, a bunch from the Midwest, and they're like, "Oh, my God, we just can't believe [it's really you]." I felt like Mickey Mouse.
And how does that feel?
It felt great, because I thought, Oh--they want me! And it felt really uncomfortable, because I thought, Oh, I don't have any privacy or boundaries that are respected. And I felt joy because I could, in some small little way, say, "Yeah, You're OK, we're OK, let's take a picture." Kind of all validate this existence together.
Quite a change from your days on Caroline in the City, when you were working with Malcolm Gets at a time before either of you was out publicly.
Is he out?
He is. He's spoken to The Advocate.
OK. Wow. I'm very excited to hear that. Good for Malcolm. There was a greater sense of comfort and ease [on that set] because I knew that there were other gay people there. We would do things socially with certain industry folk and whatnot. There are lots of people in Hollywood who are really cool about their sexuality, who are really comfortable with themselves.
But that experience you're describing--being out to some people, socializing with the gay people--that is the Hollywood closet.
Well, yeah. It's odd, really, that everyone knows that some of these folks are gay--everybody knows...I think everybody knows--and yet to go to such lengths to perpetuate a different belief. But gay people that I know and hang out with are fairly evolved folk and not buried in some of the self-hatred. I've had some higher-ups in gay Hollywood tell me [about coming out], "I want to help you in any way I can."
Even so, you'd have to agree that there's still a lot of fear in Hollywood around all things gay.
The problem is, I don't know how much of that fear is real and how much of it's perceived. I sat in New York with this guy I'm dating on a park bench in Battery Park, and it was calm and quiet and it couldn't have been more peaceful. And there was this guy down at the other end of the bench who I think was probably straight, since that's the presumption that we have in this world. But I had my arm around [my boyfriend], and I remember feeling such a sense of fear. Whenever I'm physical in public with him, there's a little part of me that thinks, Somebody could just pick up a gun and shoot us, could hit us with something or stab us.
So does Hollywood assume that its audience is the man at the other end of the park bench?
Yeah, that's right. It's about ticket buyers. What's great about [Queer as Folk] is that it shows that there's a market for gay stuff. That sort of coalescing energy, i think, is somethign that the gay community lacks--that sense of unity.
Because we are all so different, from different backgrounds.
Something my publicist had pointed out to me is that he think swhat's so interesting about my coming-out thing is that I represent a lot of my peers in corporate America, because I went to law school and I did that whole thing and put a suit on and was completely closeted at work, [then] was dating [men] and going to circuit parties in my private life. I can still remember being among my peers at the clubs and talking about the lack of role models with whom we might identify--that the people with the greatest courage, who were more likely to [be out] earlier on, were not those folks with whom we identified.
But the peers you're talking about are people who allowed themselves to be gay only in limited settings. Like a lot of guys on the circuit.
Yeah, I was a circuit guy. Was I at every circuit party? No. But it doesn't take a lot to figure ou tthat weh ave diminished opportunity to meet people. Because so many folks are hiding in our world and because most of us come from smaller towns where there are just a handful of people or a couple of bars. I think these experiences gave rise to this entity we now know as the circuit. It's the mobility of gay folk, the disposable income, [that] causes us to be able to seek out love more broadly. Because at the end of the day, that's what we're all looking for.
What did you find at circuit parties?
The experience I most remember was the final night [of my first circuit party], when I was in the middle of just a huge sea of shirtless guys and thinking that this was, like, the center of the world, that this was heaven, that I finally had freedom. Freedom is my big buzzword in life. It's just my favorite word. And I think so many of my choices have been about gaining freedom. I was just completely unchained. Do I think it's the ideal? No. Am I glad that it exists? Yeah. because there are many of us who otherwise would be still stuck in whatever towns trying to find a way to express our sexuality.
Tell me about the town where you grew up.
Born and raised in Tampa [Fla.]. I was there until I was 18.
And you grew up with a Hispanic surname, not Gant. What was it?
Gonzalez. My name's Bobby Gonzalez. The reality is, I'm as much Italian, Irish, and English as Spanish. My dad's Spanish-Italian, and my mom's Iris-English. There'a little Scottish in there as well.
But you grew up as Bobby Gonzalez.
Yeah. [Pauses] I love my parents very much. They gave to me everything they could. [But} I grew up with a strong sense of shame about not having a lot of money. It wasn't only being gay that caused me to create facades. I was a fat kid...
You were fat? At what age?
I really got fat, I'd say around third grade. I think we just had really bad eating habits--I mean, I used to go to Dairy Queen every day after school. And I was dealing with the fat that I liked guys.
When did you figure that out?
Fifth grade, probably. I remember sitting in my bedroom--we lived in an apartment complex that was right near the university--and I remember looking out my window. There was one guy in particular who used to wash his car with his shirt off and shorts. Such longing. I had such longing.
Who was your first real crush?
In the fifth grade there was a kid, Darren, that I was just gaga over. I think so much attraction is about the things that we don't believe we are. Darren was really good-looking; I didn't think that I was. He was really athletic, and I wasn't. I was always the last kid picked for kickball. I was afraid of athletics because I didn't feel part of this club.
When did you lose the weight?
It was pretty much the summer between eight and ninth [grades] when it started to turn around. Some of it was just physiological, I'm sure--puberty. But a lot of it was very focused. I definitely became very focused on physicality. I used to hide pictures, mail-outs from Charles Atlas, under my bed, and different kinds of fitness things. I remember looking in a mirror and holding the fat back to see what would I look like if I had a V shape. Regularly, I used to do that all the time.
Then you became part of the club.
Sort of. Sort of. In others' eyes, I guess I looked that way. But I was a part of a lot of different groups: At the same time I played football I was in the choral department in four or five singing groups. I did Grease in high school.
Did you do shows in college?
Yes. I was in a 12-man a cappella group for four years, and I did a number of musicals. I did Little Shop of Horrors--I was a dentist. It's a wonderful, wonderful role--second only to Harold Hill [from The Music Man].
But your plan in college was to prepare for law school.
Yeah. I had thought for a long time that I would be a lawyer. Because I was from this blue-collar background, I thought, OK, that's prestigious! I would wear a suit and I would go to abig office and make money--and what a shallow existence it was! [Laughs] I actually loved going to law school. It really worked with my mind, because I tend to be a little hyperanalytical. Maybe a lot hyperanalytical.
But even in law school--
--the vast majority of my time was given to my artistic pursuits. I formed a six-man a cappella group with one of the guys I knew from college and four other guys from Tufts. I joined the Georgetown Gilbert and Sullivan Society. I was in a production of The Mikado. And then I did Trial by Jury--
Looking back, do you think you were trying not to have too much time with yourself?
Yeah, I'm sure that was part of it. I'm sure. Right, because my happiness and my sense of worth were externally sourced. I no longer think that to be true.
How was your dating life through all of these pursuits?
You know, I'm sad to say--it's embarrassing to say--I had girlfriends, and it was never truthful. It was a self-serving choice to hide. I regret that, but at the same time, that was the process.
So you hadn't even had an experience with a man at that point?
My first experience with a guy...[Laughs] Inquiring minds want to know.Oy. The end of my junior year of high school--I was going to the senior prom. yeah. Prom night was my first time.
With another guy in your school?
Yeah, with another guy in high school--another guy on the football team [laughs]. It doesn't get any better than that! It was a complete fantasy: I'd sort of heard rumors about him, that he never really made moves on these particular girls that he dated, and I of course listened with great interest. So I made sure that prom night at the dance we got really, really shit-faced, and I just made the move. And we ended up fooling around in the stairwall at the hotel we all went to afterward.
And that didn't make you say, "I need to do this more often?"
Oh, absolutely it did. And I did. One day [that summer] I drove al the way across town to this club that was basically a box of cinder blocks painted gray--very inconspicuous. I remember just parking--sitting in the parking lot for, like, 45 minutest and seeing only guys coming out. My heart was in my throat. I went in, and I didn't even think about the fact that they might card me or whatever. Fortunately, I looked older; I've always looked older than my age, so that helped things a bit. In reality, they probably aren't really carding that some 16-year-old kid's coming into their club.
Were you glad you'd gone in?
I remember being just elated beyond description. So excited, so terrified-all at once. It was like, all these guys dancing together to this disco music...
So the elation overcame the fear.
Yeah. I mean, so strong were those desires that I think they weren't going to be stayed. [But] they were acted upon in a way that wasn't open. I was in hiding. I frequented clubs and did in college [as well]. And I joined a fraternity that was, like, the ultimate jock fraternity--it was mostly lacrosse players and wrestlers and baseball players.
When did it stop being your secret life and just become your life?
It happened in degrees. I had my first significant boyfriend my senior year in college. And I think that's when I started to realize some of those desires for creating a family and creating a home--and love. Things that I hadn't before. I hadn't thought that they were my right.
You thought that you would need to try to be somebody that you weren't in order to live your life?
I always assumed I would get married and just pretend. That was my earliest thing--I'll definitely get married--because I saw no other [option]. I was going to get married and have kids. And then at some point I said [to myself], Well, I'll meet a lesbian and we'll pretend to the rest of the world, and then at some point we'll have surrogate kids. And then I thought, No, I'll be with a guy--this is the gradual part; this is probably senior year in college--I'll be with a guy and we'll have a surrogate child together. But there was still that sense of hiding--people won't really know. I don't know what I was thinking. But what's beautiful about thisprocess is where I've come to. And where I'm going.
You're dating a guy now. What's his name?
I don't know that I'd want to put that pressure on the relationship. I haven't talked to him about it--although he couldn't be more comfortable with his sexuality. That's certainly not an issue. We've been dating for four months, so we're in this wonderful process of getting to know one another. He's quite a wonderful man. Wonderful soul, and spiritually, there are a lot of things in common that way.
You also have that in common with Ben, your character on Queer as Folk. I kind of feel like Ben is able to say things that no one on the show has been able to--things that sound like things you might say. I've had friends call me to say, "Do you write your own dialogue?" I have had three or four people say that to me.
So tell me a little bit about your preparing to play Ben.
I totally related to his spirituality and his evolutionary process. I really related to his propensity for literature, and I really got the duality between [those parts] of him: the bibliophile and the guy on the dance floor. And it's hard to be a gay man and not know a lot about HIV. I've had plenty of experiences--
Are there friends who've been HIV-positive that come to your mind?
Absolutely. A lot. A lot. It's something I've been interacting with for a number of years. I really, really wanted to do justice to Ben because I felt a sense of obligation to portray him in a way that really was respectful.
A group calling itself Queers Against Queer as Folk was upset that Ben was not immediately embraced by the other characters.
I think they jumped the gun a little bit on that. Whether it's Ben or it's Vic [Michael's HIV]positive uncle], I'm really glad that the exploration of HIV in gay culture has become such an integral part of the show, because it is and has been one of the single most galvanizing forces in the gay community. It has perhaps single-handedly created the sense of family and community that today exists. So it makes sense to me that people are passionate about it and that Queers Against Queer as Folk exists. That's one of the things I love about the show: It pisses people off--it provokes people to take a position.
Ben says at one point, talking about gay people, "They don't want to think about...gay bashing or about AIDS or any of the other shit we have to live with." That's a point the show might not have been able to make without Ben to make it.
You have to start in a place that calls for growth to see growth occur. I think that's what the second season has been all about, but [the show] had to start at a place that called for growth.
As you feel you did.
I lead far from a perfect existence, as we said, and I have plenty of flaws and foibles, but I like who I'm becoming.
You look amazing. Talk a little bit about your body; what being in the shape you're in means to you.
You know, for a long time I [worked out] for entirely different reasons: It was much more to be accepted and to be loved. Now it's much more about self-nurture and self-care. And about my business. I literally have to take my clothes off on television--it's important I stay in shape, from that standpoint.
Is there a connection between your strong sense of spirituality and the explicit eroticism of the show?
Sex isn't a spiritually exclusive phenomenon. You can have hot, fun sex and have that kind of connection with one's partner--indeed,that is the ideal. I think maybe what you're getting at is that on the show there are representations of questionable connetions. That's certainly true in the gay world--some of our sexual connections are dysfunctional, and they lead to unhealthy relationships. Of course, it's also true in the straight world.
Why are gay men so body-obsessed?
Definitely, this perfect-bdy thing--it only gets perpetuated by the male-on-male dynamic. Women are traditionally socialized to look for a breadwinner--traditionally, I say, not so much in today's world--and men are socialized to look for quote-unquote beauty. And because we have men-on-men in our culture, we go after both. So we have to make money and we have to have a perfect body. but the inherent problems in the pursuit don't elude me. I'm aware now of the prison that we continue to put ourselves in and that I protentially help to perpetuate the search for body perfection, and I'm not claiming to be so godlike as to be free from the desire to want to look good. [Laughs] Let's see: "Be the change you wish to see in the world." I'm not sure how that plays out in this.
Well, I think one advantage to being gay is that at least you're forced to deal with all these issues, to put some effort into achieving freedom--that buzzword of yours.
I think as a kid I wasn't even aware of the extent to which my freedom was being infringed upon. We're conditioned not even to know that we're not free. When you think about what we all believe America to be, it just seems ludicrous that so much of America's populace lives in this sort of prison. I think coming out for me is really about tearing down the prison wall.